Hey everyone, welcome back to the podcast. I'm really excited to share with you the interview I did with my friend Catie Borland. Many of you know Catie, and if you don't, you're in for a treat. And honestly, this episode might surprise you because as much as we talk about entrepreneurship and abundance mindset and alignment and God working through you and making money.
Today's episode is about putting your business down and how that was one of the most aligned choices that Catie could make, and she had a successful business before she put it down. And she might pick it back up again, she kind of talks about that, which is fun, but I think there needs to be more discussion, honestly, about this option. And I'm not saying, hey, I think you should put your business down, but alignment can look a lot of different ways in different seasons.
And so I think this interview, this conversation that I have with Catie is just a fresh perspective, and I love it so much. I love Catie so much, and I think you're going to love our conversation. So let's jump in.
Amber: Okay, Catie, welcome to the podcast.
Catie: Hi, I'm so glad to be here.
Amber: I'm glad you're here. Okay, so you and I are chatting a little bit. We've known each other for kind of a long time now, it feels like.
Catie: I know.
Amber: I have a lot of reasons that I want to have a conversation with you today, but I think it would be great to provide some context for the people listening. Maybe we can start with you becoming a life coach. Is that okay? Like kind of how you made that decision? And I think I met you after you started coaching. So let’s start there.
Catie: Yes. Okay. So I became a coach in 2018. I was so excited. I hadn't known anything about this work. And then I learned about it in 2017. And I started applying the things I learned. And it was so powerful being able to use thought work and all of these skills and tools to help you create the life you want and to help with emotions. And I just ate it up. I ate it up. And I knew that I wanted to help others do this work. And I felt very called to do it.
So I started coaching in 2018. And I quickly hit the ground running. I was hustling. I was go, go, go, diving deep into strategy and all of these things that come with having a business and really being in masculine energy, which is not natural for me, which is probably why I burned out so quickly. It was like, I was focused so much on the business side and trying to figure all of that out and how to make money and how to do it most effectively.
And I realized that over time, I was guiding others towards alignment, while parts of my life were drifting out of alignment. And I was exhausted by it. So the first time I quit, which some people might not know, I remember feeling so much shame and embarrassment, because I really put myself out there. I think I started a podcast like the first week I was doing all the things. And I had invested a lot of time and a lot of money.
And I felt really confused as to why I was feeling so out of alignment when I actually felt very guided and led to become a coach in the first place. So I was like, yes, God approves. He wants me to do this work. So it's going to just be amazing every step of the way. I'm so excited. I know the plan. And so I remember the night when I wanted to tell my husband. And I wasn't so much worried about what he would say. But again, it was just this feeling of shame. And so...
Amber: You had invested money. Like the shame, was it because you had like put a lot of time, resources, money into it?
Catie: Yes.
Amber: Or was it quitting that you felt shame about?
Catie: All of it. I went into it with so much optimism and just thinking, I'm not going to fail because I've got God on my side. I'm doing the things. And I just was running faster than I was meant to. And so I remember telling my husband, I need to talk to you tonight. And so we got into the bed and I was laying in the bed in the dark and looking up at the ceiling. And he was beside me looking up at the ceiling. And I said, I don't think I want to do this anymore. Like, I just don't think I want to.
Amber: And... what were you doing? Were you doing one-on-one coaching? You're podcasting? You're creating content?
Catie: All of the above. Plans of group coaching and all of these things. And it really just became about building this business and being so excited about making money and all of it. And I was go, go, go. And like I said, I was helping people. And I really was. I really truly felt like I was helping the few clients that I had. I was not making a lot of money. Hardly any at all. But I was going to bed feeling burned out. I was feeling so distracted where I really felt like content and happy in my motherhood before that.
Obviously, there are always things that we're working on and hard days and things. But as a whole, I felt like I was showing up in integrity with who I wanted to be as a mom. And so, my husband was so loving and supportive. And he's like, quit. I don't care. He's like, I just want you back. He said that to me. I just want you back. Like your happy, fun, more present self. And I felt so much relief. I felt so much relief and happiness and peace. It was like I gave myself permission in that moment to fully quit.
Amber: Put it all down.
Catie: Put it all down. But what was so interesting was in that very same breath, I said, oh, okay. So, I think this is what I'm going to do. I'm not going to advertise. I'm not going to put stuff out unless I feel prompted or guided. And if someone reaches out to me, then I will work with them. If it happens organically,
Amber: I won’t make it happen.
Catie: Yes, yes. I was leaning heavy into that feminine energy, which feels way more natural to me of just flow and just letting things happen and come to me. And funny enough, as soon as I did that, I think it was for sure that week. I got a call from somebody who wanted to coach with me. And because I didn't have this graspiness of clients and needing this and that, I said, sure.
And this is how much it'll be to work with me. And I doubled my price right there. I felt unafraid of saying it because I genuinely did not need them. I don't want to say I didn't care as in I didn't want to care to help them, but I was no longer going to help other people at the expense of helping those in my home. So they said, great, perfect. I want to work with you. And I just started getting clients and I ended up having as many clients as I wanted to have.
Amber: And this is after you're like, I'm quitting.
Catie: Exactly. You know what? It was like such a gift from God. And I remember my husband. I remember exactly where he was when I got off that phone call. And I came in and I said, you're not going to believe what just happened. And he looked at me and he said, this is God's way of showing you when you surrender to me. You have no idea what I can do. And I knew that was true. It was like a gift for doing something that felt so scary when I wanted to do what felt right for me. So I quit and started my business all in one day.
Amber: And sign your highest paying client ever.
Catie: Yes, exactly. What surprised me was at this point. So fast forward a little bit. That was probably, I don't know, 2019 or 2020 or something like that.
Amber: Isn't time weird? It’s like wait, what?
Catie: It’s so weird. It was interesting knowing I was going to talk to you kind of thinking through the timeline of things. And I'm like, wow, so much time and no time at all has gone by. Like what is even going on? But what I found so interesting is now I was in this place of alignment in my business. It felt easy. It felt fun. It felt peaceful. And it was from this place that I felt prompted to put it down. And it wasn't unlike the first time that I quit. It wasn't one big moment.
It was just this gentle guiding to this place of putting it down. It went against all logic, especially for what I was teaching women at that time. And I am a firm believer in today, which is you can have both. My brain was screaming at me to make sense of it. Like you're making the money you want to make. You're working the hours you want to work. I mean, you're still running a business just like life. Not everything is perfect every day. But I did feel at peace in my business.
But I chose to not listen to my brain and go deep within my heart and follow that peaceful feeling, even with the questions still. I think it was maybe six months to a year later, I had shared in a post on my Instagram, a little bit about this experience. You know, why I wasn't working in my business anymore and how I put it down. And I was even open and said, you know, there's still times that I ask myself, if I had all that I wanted in my business, why was I putting it down and thinking I needed to do the deeper work? Right. Because that's what I was taught.
Amber: Oh, that's what we're taught. Totally. You're sabotaging limiting beliefs.
Catie: Yes. You need to expand. You need to make room for capacity and all of these things. I don't know if you remember this, but you commented on that. And it's something that you said set me free and has set me free time and time again. And it was something along the lines of the best self-help is choosing what you feel called to do without needing deeper meaning.
I just loved that so much. I didn't need to make sense of it on paper. I didn't need to prove to myself or my spouse or past clients or followers on Instagram. It could pass. You know, I didn't need to do that. I could just go with what I felt and let peace be the truth teller for me. And so I did.
Amber: So when was that?
Catie: I think that was in 2022. Okay. The end of 2022 or the beginning of 2023.
Amber: Yeah. So you put it all down. Did you have anyone be like, what are you doing? Was everyone really supportive?
Catie: Oh, I feel like people were so supportive, but there were people asking, but I think more out of curiosity of like, where did you go? You know, because I had a, I was present online. I was sharing a lot.
Amber: Yeah. And people still love your content, but yeah, you're an awesome creator.
Catie: Yes. Thank you. But yeah, so I stopped even creating content.
Amber: I remember that. Yeah. Went dark, went off.
Catie: Went dark in all the best ways. And I just leaned into my home and things I wanted to do. And it was so, and has been so beautiful. And also not without its challenges, which again, I think I was thinking the same way I thought, see Heavenly Father is letting me learn this lesson time and time again. This is what he's asked me to do.
So this must be where all of the ease is going to be. And while there is so much ease and beauty and joy and happiness in my life and in my marriage and in my parenting, there are still challenges. There's still room for growth, but because I followed that prompting, there's peace in it. Even in the challenges, there's peace because I know that I'm where I'm supposed to be.
Amber: Yeah. I remember you and I both like this account. Her name is Peta Jean. She has a very similar piece to her motherhood that I think you portray. Cause like, this is what I love about this conversation is like, people can listen to our conversation. Some people like me feel really peaceful about having a business.
And I think there's some people that like, they would feel more peaceful if they put it down, but that feels crazy because that's not what the world would say to do. Like, how did you get to the place where like, despite even your own brain, right? Your own brain was like, what are you doing? Like, how would you describe the knowing or like the spiritual, like revelation that you were feeling before you put it down? Like before you really walked away?
Catie: Yeah. It's deep in your soul. You don't have the words to describe it. I had spent enough time being still that I knew that it was from God and I knew that it was the move for me. I love what you said about how you feel so much peace in having a business. And I know that. I know that you live in integrity with yourself.
I have another dear friend who has a very successful business and she's very successful in her marriage and in her parenting and in her life. And I think I used to, especially in the beginning, I would compare myself to those who were doing all of the things and wanting to do it myself. In the beginning, it was really those boss babes, right, who were hustling and getting it done. And I see the success that they were having, at least outward success.
And I thought oh, I want to do that. I can do that. And I tried to imitate which caused burnout. And then when I started leaning into my feminine energy, I started comparing myself to those who also leaned into their feminine energy, who were really aligned in their lives and alignment looks different for everybody. And I think I would look at people like you or even my friend and think, wow, they are so aligned that this must be how I'm supposed to do it. That's what alignment looks like.
Amber: Yes, that's what alignment looks like.
Catie: That’s what alignment looks like. They are fulfilled in their marriages and in their homes and in their businesses. So I just need to do what they do. But I started to realize that alignment is different for everybody. We have different gifts. We have different talents. God wants us to work at different paces than each other and timeline.
And it's designed beautifully that way. So instead of asking the question, you know, how can I do it like Amber who lives in alignment or my friend who lives in alignment? I just started asking, you know, how can I be that faithful to my own path?
Amber: Yes.
Catie: Instead of how you do it, the strategy or what you're doing, because I don't think there's anything wrong with looking at others and admiring even like this Peta Jean. When you had sent me her blog post once, I literally laid on my bed for an hour. I just felt so overcome with the spirit and peace. And it resonated with me so deeply and was one of the reasons, one of the little parts and me putting down my business.
Amber: Yeah. And it's funny because I read it too. Felt the same thing as you. It's like it was about reclaiming your home. If you don't follow Peta Jean, I recommend it, especially if you're a mom, because she's really like moms belong in the home in a not anti-feminist way is like how I'll say it. Like it's a very inspiring, loving, godly way of thinking about being a mother.
And what's funny is like I never felt like I had to quit my business, but for you, it helped you make that decision. And so I love what you're saying about alignment. It's not like, oh, alignment is keeping the business or alignment is quitting the business. Like it's so personal.
Catie: Yes. And it's always for a season or maybe not. Maybe it's for a long time, but it could be for a season. I knew when I was quitting my business that I was going to pick it up.
Amber: Yeah.
Catie: I knew it. I didn't put it down and say that was it. And now I'm just in the home and that's all I'm focusing on. I knew that I was going to pick it back up and I still know it. And I am feeling those promptings and I am feeling I'm actually in a place where I'm not in a rush, but totally open to kind of like, what is it Heavenly Father?
Amber: That's exciting.
Catie: What are we going to do? And being able to follow that. I stopped posting on Instagram and I felt at the end of last year, prompted to start sharing again. And when I had started my business account for Instagram, it was with the purpose of getting clients, building my one-on-one coaching, my retreat, sharing content there so people will get to know me so that they will work with me.
Amber: There's a so that, like I post content.
Catie: So that, right? It was a business strategy. So to feel prompted to post with no offer. I've been doing this since January.
Amber: There's like no way to pay you.
Catie: No way to pay me. There's no offer. And at first it felt like, man, this doesn't really make sense, especially when I'm listening to people who are talking about Instagram or, you know, growing your Instagram. And if you're not collecting money, then it's just a hobby and you're not making the most out of it. Like you should be paid for what you're doing.
And it makes sense, right? On paper, that makes sense. And sometimes I still can get caught up and going, wait, yeah, why am I doing this just for funsies? Like, what is the point? But I'm just trying to be obedient to the promptings that I have felt from the Spirit. And I feel like that's the lesson I'm learning is trust me and I will show you the way and just be ready.
Amber: Do you think almost like at the beginning of your business that didn't because I know you're it's not like you're like a disobedient person, like you're a very good person. But do you think that that's what was missing when you started originally?
Catie: Yeah, I think I get excited. I think I get one answer and then I go, oh, this is good for me to do? I have permission to do this? Okay, see, I'm off to the races like I'm going instead of like taking him with me every step of the way. I just made the one thing he mean true for the rest of my life instead of this season or this step.
Amber: Yeah.
Catie: And I was making my desires the anchor instead of the compass and making him not the anchor where I've tried to turn that and have him be the anchor and still having my passion and my desires. But using that more as like a compass of showing me where I want to go and then letting God really lead me by being anchored in Him, if that makes sense.
Amber: Yeah, it kind of reminds me of the Israelites and they're like praying for manna, you know, like they could only take what was good for the day. And they had to go out every day like their daily bread, you know?
Catie: Yes.
Amber: And like that was in.
Catie: Yes. And learning about myself and my personality. I keep referencing my friend, but she is very decisive. She can make decisions very quickly and she doesn't really second guess them. And most of the time that works out for her. I think that's her gift. I think that is a spiritual gift she has. And she knows that about herself.
And I've come to learn that I get very excited and I'm very passionate and I need to be temperate. I need to be still and have this exciting idea and then pause and take it to the Lord. And so I've really worked on becoming who God wants me to be and learning about myself, what he wants me to learn about myself. And it's still very much a journey.
Amber: Yeah, for sure. I mean, I know you're not done.
Catie: No, that's one lesson I have learned. Whatever I think it's supposed to be right now, I know is not how it's always going to be.
Amber: Yeah. So you said the word alignment. I kind of want to pick your brain because I think that's a buzzword for a lot of people. Do you have a definition or like how would you explain alignment?
Catie: That's a great question. I always ask my husband when he's explaining things to me, can you explain it to me like I'm a kindergartner? Just break it down for me. And I think the most simple way I can put it is being still enough to let God reach your soul and let you know what is meant for you and what's not meant for you.
Amber: And it has nothing to do with what other people are doing.
Catie: No, it has nothing to do with being in the home, working out of the home, having a job, not having a business. It's so unique to you, your personality and your season. Are you willing to surrender what you think you want and your desires to allow God to do something better? Kind of like that example when I surrendered and I was like, okay, I'm going to drop all of this hustling and not be as present as I'd like to be in my home. Really just surrendering to what God was putting in my heart. And then he blessed me tenfold.
Amber: Yeah. Surrendering is scary though.
Catie: Yeah, it is.
Amber: Because it feels like you have control when you try to do it your way.
Catie: Yeah.
Amber: So you surrendered a lot. I mean, you surrendered your business, you surrendered making money, you surrendered your way. I bet you have some stuff to say. Because I think that the lesson, even if you keep, like I have clients that surrendering is the work that they're doing. And it's not like giving up their business, but it's like a spiritual, almost like an energetic stance that you take. I don't know if you have words for it, but I'd be curious.
Catie: Yeah. It's a practice and it can be scary. But I was just thinking for anybody listening, practice with something small. I don't think God rushes us or he's like, you need to learn this right now, or you need to do this right now. I think he knows our hearts. He knows our personality. And if you need to start with something so small in your day, start there and let him show you. Because He will, He will.
Amber: I think the other thing that goes with it is patience. Because we were like, but can you show me right now? I feel like you're in that right now. You're kind of like.
Catie: Yes. Can you show me right now? And can you show me the way? Patience is key. I love that you said that last night. I actually had an experience where I knew I needed to have a conversation with somebody in my family. And I was praying so hard. I'm like, here I am. I'm willing. Show me the way. Tell me. I have these righteous desires. I know that this is what you want me to do. So can you show me?
And I was just wrestling and wrestling, going, here I am. I'm rolling up my sleeves. Put me to work. Tell me what to say, how to approach this. It wasn't until I said, you will show me when you want to show me. You will tell me when you want to tell me. And when I really meant it, Amber, that's when the answer came. And I know it doesn't always happen that way. But if the answer doesn't come, peace will. And I have felt that.
Amber: I think you said something that is very important, because sometimes I'll be like, you can't manipulate God to my clients. You can't pretend to surrender. And then you're like, I did it. See?
Catie: Yes.
Amber: It has to be fully, genuinely letting go. You can't fake it. Because you can't manipulate the process.
Catie: And then you can really get in your head. Because there are times, I have this conversation with myself all the time. Am I trying to manipulate her? God, am I trying to manipulate you? And then you can just get so in your head. So even in those moments, I say, if this is what I'm doing, I don't want to do this.
Can you help me? If this is what's happening for me, if this is what's going on for me, will you show me how to put this down? Go one little tiny step at a time. If you're like, I don't know how to surrender, tell him that. I don't know. Do you have any suggestions?
Amber: I love that you shared that. So good. So what has it been like creating content without an agenda?
Catie: It's been so fun. And it's been all of the things. I have really been creating out of passion and excitement and desire. And not every post or every day that I post is so aligned. There's times where I just, even in my motherhood, it's the same with my relationship with Instagram. I still get distracted. I still get out of alignment.
But I'm learning that perfection isn't the goal, but return is the goal. Returning to Him, returning to what I know. And that's really what I've just been doing. And there's times where, like I said, I wake up and I can be a very distracted person. I joke that it's one of my gifts to be very distracted. I get very excited about things.
My brain goes in 100 different directions. And sometimes I go to bed feeling like, yeah, I didn't get that right. But I have an opportunity to return back to stillness, back to God. And so that's just what I've been doing. But on Instagram, it's been fun. It's been a creative outlet. I have lots of people that I'm connecting with and I'm having a really good time.
Amber: You're such a good connector.
Catie: I do love to connect.
Amber: And gatherer.
Catie: I love to connect and I love to gather. And I'm so anxious to know what I'm going to be doing in my business. But I'm so trusting that it's going to be in the right time. I do feel like something's coming. But I did feel like that in the beginning of the year, too.m I'm like, oh, it's coming.
Amber: It is coming.
Catie: It is still coming. It is still coming.
Amber: So you said they were distracted a couple of times. And I've been thinking about this a lot, too, specifically about mothers. I say this knowing I'm not perfect either, but I think there's a lot of distraction for moms, especially with business. Like it's so easy to be distracted by business. Like you said it in such a good way in the beginning of this episode. I can't remember what you said, but it's like I wasn't going to take better care of people outside of my home than I took care of inside my home. I don't know how you said it, but that was.
Catie: Yeah. Yeah. I noticed that I was helping other people at the expense of helping myself. And that just didn't feel right. I think we can get caught in this loop of feeling distracted and then feeling shame and then feeling distracted and feeling shame. And funny enough, practicing not feeling shame and having grace for myself is one of the main things that helps me not be distracted.
Amber: I love that. It's like what you're saying, like a return without shame.
Catie: Yeah.
Amber: With grace.
Catie: And knowing that this is going to happen.
Amber: Yeah. I think there's a level of honesty. You didn't say it this way, but it's almost like I've been a distracted mom and I don't want to be that way anymore. And you don't have to say that with like, and I'm an awful person. But like a level of integrity and honesty that brings you back kind of wakes you up.
Catie: Yes. You know, in the scriptures, it says remember a lot and sometimes remember, remember. And I don't feel like Heavenly Father would tell us, remember, if he didn't know we were going to forget. And so I remind myself of that. Oh, okay. Something doesn't feel right in this moment or today. Man, today was I did not get still. I did not do the things that I know will bring me true peace and happiness. And Heavenly Father lets me learn that lesson.
Amber: And He's just there. There's this book I love. It's not even about this. It's by Steve Chandler. He talks about the path and he's talking about being like a creator. So like books, art, business, whatever. Like there's this path where you want to go.
And we could use that for anything in life, relationships, spirituality, business, whatever. We wander off the path, but like the path doesn't change and the path doesn't judge you when you come back. It's just there. Right. And you wander way off and it's still just there waiting for you to come back. And then you get on the path and you keep walking.
Catie: I love that analogy. That's so true.
Amber: I think about that a lot in my own life because there's so many things. It's not just business. It's a lot of things, things that we want, hobbies, talents, things we're pursuing, things we want to take care of in the house, like whatever. There's always things we're trying to do. But it's like the self-judgment, I think, almost like I often tell my clients, judgment cements it instead of like grace lets it flow.
Catie: Yeah. Grace is critical. Every area of our life that we want to excel in, be present in, I mean, without it, you'll never get where you want to be.
Amber: Because you'll just be judging where you are.
Catie: And it feels so bad.
Amber: It does. So maybe you think, I don't know, because I think grace is a word I would use to describe you. I think you have grace with people. I think you have grace with yourself. How have you cultivated that?
Catie: One of the ways that I give myself grace is when I think about others that I love and the grace I want them to have. I think about my kids, the grace I want them to give to themselves and the grace I want others to give to them. And why am I not worthy of that as well? I'm also someone's baby. I'm also someone's sister and friend. Even with my husband, little arguments or challenges happen in marriage. I often think, this is somebody's baby boy.
And how would I want someone to treat him or the grace I would want him to be given? And can I give that to myself? I feel like that's backwards. I feel like they say, if you give yourself grace, you're able to give other people grace. But for whatever reason, maybe you can help me understand. It feels the opposite for me. I'm much quicker to want to give those around me grace. And then that helps me find grace for myself.
Amber: Yeah. Makes sense to me. Just what I know about you. I'll never forget this. We were in St. George at the retreat you were hosting. And I said something like, you're so good at loving people. Because you had gathered all these people and everyone who was there. The way that you can minister individually to people is a gift. Just so you know. We've discussed this.
Your fan club. The way that you minister individually is a gift. And I said that to you. And you said, well, it's funny because it comes through me for them. But I feel so good loving people. It's so easy for me. I love the word abundant heart. That's why I named it my podcast.
But it felt like an abundant heart where it's like, yeah, it's flowing to you, to other people, and they feel amazing. And in turn, you do too. And so you're being filled up by letting it flow out. That kind of math doesn't make sense. That's like a heaven math. That's like God does impossible math. Because as you're giving, you are being filled. That's what it feels like to me.
Catie: Gosh. And it feels so opposite of what we're taught.
Amber: Totally.
Catie: And so you just said that so beautifully. And it makes sense because I've just been scratching my head over this, thinking like, yeah, how come I can do that better for others than myself? Because that goes against what's written on paper and what the science says or what all of the studies done. But you're right. That's God math. That's God being able to put it out. And you're right. That's why it comes back. I sound so simple, but I'm having a moment of like, okay, yeah.
Amber: No, but it's profound because I think a lot of the world will teach like you have to take care of yourself, which like, that's like a have to. That's true. Like, because earlier in this conversation, we're talking about how you burned out in business. So like that is real. There’s such a thing as doing too much for the people and not enough for you.
But I think it's like the mentality. It's almost like you let things flow through you, love, grace, whatever word, right? It's different than like, I don't matter. I'm going to self-sacrifice. It's not that.
It's just like, I'm letting things flow through and we're both blessed because of that.
Catie: Gosh, I love that. And that reminds me of the theme, Peta Jean, which I need to share. You need to share too that blog post that she wrote. But she was talking about her mom and she was talking about how she's like, I rode that self-help bus until the wheels fell off and I fell flat on my knees or whatever. Right. And she was kind of looking at her mom as like, oh, she doesn't really know because her mom didn't have any of this knowledge of.
Amber: Yes. Of the self-help space.
Catie: But her mom served hard and served and loved people. And it's like we complicate things. We're like, can we go back to the basics? Love thy neighbor. Love God. And what a difference in our lives it would make in our business, in our homes if we just did those two things.
Amber: It's so good. It is very counter to what mainstream media would say, though.
Catie: I've noticed in this conversation how and I mean this in an exciting way and not like, oh, man, but I still have a lot to learn and unlearning.
Amber: Yeah, everyone does. As we wrap up, Catie, I'm thinking of the woman who maybe was at a point in time where you were because it's not like things are bad. Your life is good. And I think a lot of people are there where it's like, yeah, they have a good marriage, like things are fine. But yeah, like discontent in their soul, which is different than something circumstantially wrong. Like, what would you share with her?
Catie: She is not going to want to hear this, but get well, go for a walk, sit still and pull out a piece of paper or just talk out loud, whichever one you want and just practice surrendering because you're feeling that for a reason. And don't be afraid of what He might say. I think that's why we're afraid of surrendering, because what if it's not what I want?
Amber: What if it's not what I want to hear?
Catie: What if it's not what I want? I need to keep working in my business. I need to quit my business. But I promise you, you will be pleasantly surprised. It will be beyond what you could have ever hoped it would be. And you'll feel it. You'll feel it deep in your bones and then your brain's going to try to tell you, oh, this doesn't make sense or that. But you will not want to let go of that feeling so much so that you are able to ignore that part of your brain and you just want to sit in it.
Amber: Yeah.
Catie: You'll know. Don't be afraid. Better than what you think. Better than what you are imagining. Way better.
Amber: Yeah. I went to an AA meeting when I was getting my master's. We had to attend an AA meeting just as like part of the curriculum. One of the things that they say is your best thinking got you here because the idea is they surrendered to a higher power of their own understanding. That's part of the AA program. And I think even if you're not an alcoholic, it's a useful like your best thinking, your best logical thinking got you here. And if you're feeling soul discontent, maybe it's not your thinking that's going to get you where you are meant to go.
Catie: Yes. I love that so much. Surrender to God and surrender to the idea that Amber's way or my way is right. Because I love that you pointed out like you and I are doing things differently, but we're both living in integrity with ourselves.
Amber: Yeah.
Catie: And we both feel that inner peace.
Amber: Yeah. And we even both read the same piece of content. That's something that has changed my experience. She is like we read the same blog post and had a transformation in our hearts. We did. Both of us.
Catie: Yes.
Amber: It looked the same. Right. And I think sometimes we want alignment from the outside in. You know what I mean? Like, oh, they do it that way. Your friend's a good decision maker. Right. We're looking at the outside and trying to bring it in. But like God works from the inside out. And so it has to be internal and it's going to look and manifest itself different for everyone.
Catie: Yes. I love this so much.
Amber: So good. Thank you for sharing your gifts, Catie. You're amazing.
Catie: Thank you.
I know people can't hire you.
Catie: Not yet. I don't know what I'm doing.
Amber: You create awesome content. They can follow along until you offer one day.
Catie: Yes. You can follow me along on Catie Borland, C-A-T-I-E Borland on Instagram. And we have a good time over there.
Amber: It's so fun. Okay. Thank you, Catie.
Catie: Thank you, Amber.
